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	<title>Comments on: How will we pay for journalism?</title>
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	<link>http://blog.hackbash.com/2008/09/02/how-will-we-pay-for-journalism/</link>
	<description>once were journalists</description>
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		<title>By: Tom</title>
		<link>http://blog.hackbash.com/2008/09/02/how-will-we-pay-for-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-1381</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Sep 2008 07:32:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.hackbash.com/?p=295#comment-1381</guid>
		<description>Sorry, my time machine&#039;s playing up - but then it is overdue an MOT. Should go back to last week and book it in. In any case, I wonder if we&#039;re actually talking about similar systems, but with a difference of scale?
I suppose my key concern with relying on non-journalists for news is time: who&#039;s going to have the time to put into worthy but research-heavy stories of the drags-on-for-months variety if they&#039;re doing it outside or around another job? Hence it seems to me that some kind of professional journalism is still very much needed - but maybe on a different scale, catering to a smaller paid-for audience. Can&#039;t see any reason why small scale, high quality nonprofessional journalism and small scale, high quality paid-for professional journalism couldn&#039;t coexist happily and benefit one another, though.
As for adverts - not sure I&#039;d pay for good ones, but I&#039;d certainly pay a service that could limit my exposure to bad ones. Is that the same thing?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry, my time machine&#8217;s playing up &#8211; but then it is overdue an MOT. Should go back to last week and book it in. In any case, I wonder if we&#8217;re actually talking about similar systems, but with a difference of scale?<br />
I suppose my key concern with relying on non-journalists for news is time: who&#8217;s going to have the time to put into worthy but research-heavy stories of the drags-on-for-months variety if they&#8217;re doing it outside or around another job? Hence it seems to me that some kind of professional journalism is still very much needed &#8211; but maybe on a different scale, catering to a smaller paid-for audience. Can&#8217;t see any reason why small scale, high quality nonprofessional journalism and small scale, high quality paid-for professional journalism couldn&#8217;t coexist happily and benefit one another, though.<br />
As for adverts &#8211; not sure I&#8217;d pay for good ones, but I&#8217;d certainly pay a service that could limit my exposure to bad ones. Is that the same thing?</p>
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		<title>By: Euan W Semple</title>
		<link>http://blog.hackbash.com/2008/09/02/how-will-we-pay-for-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-1361</link>
		<dc:creator>Euan W Semple</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Sep 2008 22:29:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.hackbash.com/?p=295#comment-1361</guid>
		<description>Woah - that was like being an extra in Life On Mars and being shot back twenty years - warn me before you do that again!

People inreasingly aren&#039;t masses that can be milked to shore up bad products or shoddy journalism. Passionate niches is closer to how I see things. I already pay for some blogs and some podcats - not journalists but journalistic activity -  and I was saying to a big ad agancy the other day that I would actually seriously consider paying a premium for good, relevant advertising instead of tha mass market stuff I have shouted at me on a daily basis about products I have no interest in.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Woah &#8211; that was like being an extra in Life On Mars and being shot back twenty years &#8211; warn me before you do that again!</p>
<p>People inreasingly aren&#8217;t masses that can be milked to shore up bad products or shoddy journalism. Passionate niches is closer to how I see things. I already pay for some blogs and some podcats &#8211; not journalists but journalistic activity &#8211;  and I was saying to a big ad agancy the other day that I would actually seriously consider paying a premium for good, relevant advertising instead of tha mass market stuff I have shouted at me on a daily basis about products I have no interest in.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom</title>
		<link>http://blog.hackbash.com/2008/09/02/how-will-we-pay-for-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-1359</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Sep 2008 20:13:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.hackbash.com/?p=295#comment-1359</guid>
		<description>The way I see it, they&#039;re a necessary part of the equation unless people can charge money for news. Consider four options:

a) Masses + Adverts = Journalists get paid, life is peachy.
b) No masses + Adverts = No advertisers, no pay, doom, gloom.
c) Masses + Paid-for content = We all buy private islands. Woohoo.
d) No masses + Paid-for content = Journalists get paid, life is peachy.

Obviously option C is a fantasy land and B doesn&#039;t bear thinking about. So with that in mind, it seems to me that people either need to charge for news content (D, as per my suggestion) or else they need the masses to be interested in it (A, but see comments about quality above). Or is there a better way?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The way I see it, they&#8217;re a necessary part of the equation unless people can charge money for news. Consider four options:</p>
<p>a) Masses + Adverts = Journalists get paid, life is peachy.<br />
b) No masses + Adverts = No advertisers, no pay, doom, gloom.<br />
c) Masses + Paid-for content = We all buy private islands. Woohoo.<br />
d) No masses + Paid-for content = Journalists get paid, life is peachy.</p>
<p>Obviously option C is a fantasy land and B doesn&#8217;t bear thinking about. So with that in mind, it seems to me that people either need to charge for news content (D, as per my suggestion) or else they need the masses to be interested in it (A, but see comments about quality above). Or is there a better way?</p>
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		<title>By: Euan</title>
		<link>http://blog.hackbash.com/2008/09/02/how-will-we-pay-for-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-1343</link>
		<dc:creator>Euan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Sep 2008 12:03:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.hackbash.com/?p=295#comment-1343</guid>
		<description>Who said anything about masses?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Who said anything about masses?</p>
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		<title>By: Tom</title>
		<link>http://blog.hackbash.com/2008/09/02/how-will-we-pay-for-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-1336</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Sep 2008 09:19:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.hackbash.com/?p=295#comment-1336</guid>
		<description>I may be in a grumpy mood this morning, but I remain unconvinced that the great masses of internet users, washed or otherwise, place any greater value in good content than the aforementioned media execs. Or to put it another way: what excites most people, and so what people create and link to, is drek.

And with that in mind, perhaps what&#039;s needed online is two tier online news: if fewer people want good news content, and it&#039;s more expensive to produce, then maybe the &quot;give it away for free and pray for enough ad traffic&quot; model isn&#039;t suitable. Maybe what&#039;s needed is a high-quality, vigorously reported and edited, paid-for news product. Like, you know, a magazine (ahem - due disclosure, blah blah). Hasn&#039;t worked in the past, but if everything else is sliding downhill into chaos, then who knows.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I may be in a grumpy mood this morning, but I remain unconvinced that the great masses of internet users, washed or otherwise, place any greater value in good content than the aforementioned media execs. Or to put it another way: what excites most people, and so what people create and link to, is drek.</p>
<p>And with that in mind, perhaps what&#8217;s needed online is two tier online news: if fewer people want good news content, and it&#8217;s more expensive to produce, then maybe the &#8220;give it away for free and pray for enough ad traffic&#8221; model isn&#8217;t suitable. Maybe what&#8217;s needed is a high-quality, vigorously reported and edited, paid-for news product. Like, you know, a magazine (ahem &#8211; due disclosure, blah blah). Hasn&#8217;t worked in the past, but if everything else is sliding downhill into chaos, then who knows.</p>
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		<title>By: handolio</title>
		<link>http://blog.hackbash.com/2008/09/02/how-will-we-pay-for-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-1313</link>
		<dc:creator>handolio</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 21:22:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.hackbash.com/?p=295#comment-1313</guid>
		<description>Sorry, that was a cheap joke in response to some well-considered comments, as is my wont.

@Chris - Beautifully, wonderfully put (first point, that is. The seventh one was a cheap gag, too :-))

@David - lovely Denmark. They have proper papers and proper cafes and art and stunningly beautiful women. Maybe I should move to Copenhagen?

@CPev - I love that idea of balance being created between providers, but surely the balance comes from the reader, who chooses which providers to pay attention to? Aren&#039;t &lt;em&gt;networks of attention&lt;/em&gt; just another way of outsourcing quality control to the reader?

@Tom &amp; Euan - there is good content out there, hidden under the weight of dreadful content. Euan&#039;s right, though, and his comment may bring us full circle to Chris&#039; original musing:
&lt;blockquote&gt;I wonder if the higher rungs will just be the lower rungs out-of-hours.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
I&#039;d defend our fumbling self-analysis on Hackbash above most of what we&#039;ve managed to achieve for our clients. It&#039;s wonderful to be able to write almost anything. Perhaps we don&#039;t make the most of the privilege?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry, that was a cheap joke in response to some well-considered comments, as is my wont.</p>
<p>@Chris &#8211; Beautifully, wonderfully put (first point, that is. The seventh one was a cheap gag, too <img src='http://blog.hackbash.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> )</p>
<p>@David &#8211; lovely Denmark. They have proper papers and proper cafes and art and stunningly beautiful women. Maybe I should move to Copenhagen?</p>
<p>@CPev &#8211; I love that idea of balance being created between providers, but surely the balance comes from the reader, who chooses which providers to pay attention to? Aren&#8217;t <em>networks of attention</em> just another way of outsourcing quality control to the reader?</p>
<p>@Tom &#038; Euan &#8211; there is good content out there, hidden under the weight of dreadful content. Euan&#8217;s right, though, and his comment may bring us full circle to Chris&#8217; original musing:</p>
<blockquote><p>I wonder if the higher rungs will just be the lower rungs out-of-hours.</p></blockquote>
<p>I&#8217;d defend our fumbling self-analysis on Hackbash above most of what we&#8217;ve managed to achieve for our clients. It&#8217;s wonderful to be able to write almost anything. Perhaps we don&#8217;t make the most of the privilege?</p>
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		<title>By: handolio</title>
		<link>http://blog.hackbash.com/2008/09/02/how-will-we-pay-for-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-1312</link>
		<dc:creator>handolio</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 21:01:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.hackbash.com/?p=295#comment-1312</guid>
		<description>Yep. I&#039;ve got a two-bedroom one.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yep. I&#8217;ve got a two-bedroom one.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris T-T</title>
		<link>http://blog.hackbash.com/2008/09/02/how-will-we-pay-for-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-1310</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris T-T</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 20:46:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.hackbash.com/?p=295#comment-1310</guid>
		<description>Handolio can&#039;t be VP, he knows what a condom is.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Handolio can&#8217;t be VP, he knows what a condom is.</p>
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		<title>By: Euan W Semple</title>
		<link>http://blog.hackbash.com/2008/09/02/how-will-we-pay-for-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-1308</link>
		<dc:creator>Euan W Semple</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 19:54:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.hackbash.com/?p=295#comment-1308</guid>
		<description>Tom not a problem but an incentive to make good stuff that people get excited about and point to rather than hawking your soul in front of media execs!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tom not a problem but an incentive to make good stuff that people get excited about and point to rather than hawking your soul in front of media execs!</p>
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		<title>By: Tom</title>
		<link>http://blog.hackbash.com/2008/09/02/how-will-we-pay-for-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-1292</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 08:50:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.hackbash.com/?p=295#comment-1292</guid>
		<description>Rather depends on somebody else producing quality content in the first place, though. And therein lies the problem..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rather depends on somebody else producing quality content in the first place, though. And therein lies the problem..</p>
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